This morning, a long-time chatter and blogger who went MIA for most of this year came back to share a relatively simple "con-job-that-despite-its simplicity-almost-got-away" with us, further to my article on newbie. Apparently, the modus operandi is similar which involves instilling confidence amongst the chatbox readers, but completely different in approach in execution. Instead of recommending stock tips, his plan involves "managing funds" on behalf of others. Here's the gist of the actual exhange in my chatbox:
To keep it brief, I have removed some of the other chatters comments that are not strictly related to the conversation, and some minor typo corrections, as the conversation are many as usual ... Please note that the chatbox works from bottom-up, so, you'll have to start reading from the bottom.
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19 Dec 08, 12:58 ethan: liar is here and there, and u should judge urself is it worth to earn a little more $$ by risking urself on losing 100%
19 Dec 08, 12:57 ethan: so be extra careful with ur money, especially in bad economy time.
19 Dec 08, 12:56 ethan: another example, remember madoff scandal? the owner also dunno what the fund is doing, so ends up ? really buy fund for fun only...thats bad...
19 Dec 08, 12:55 ethan: check it out urself ya wind as i am not lawyer.. hoho..but i read it somewhere at newspaper
19 Dec 08, 12:54 ethan: as the contract will void itself if it is for illegal stuff from legal point of view
19 Dec 08, 12:54 ethan: wind, as from what i know, if it is a private fund, which is illegal in malaysia, it seem contract doesnot make sense
19 Dec 08, 12:51 ethan: how can u trust somebody to take over ur fund as u are the one that will care it the most
19 Dec 08, 12:50 ethan: he may lost all previous client
19 Dec 08, 12:49 ethan: easy, he stil use his agent id to do biz, if we report to sc and futmc , he will be in deep ****..
19 Dec 08, 12:49 Windsurfer: ethan, how did u manage to make the con man give back the money ??
19 Dec 08, 12:48 ethan: seng, u are welcome to use it since it is good for everybody, but the figure is 4k, not 8k .:)
19 Dec 08, 12:46 Seng: Ethan, I assume you are okay for me to write something based on what you just said here?
19 Dec 08, 12:46 Seng: Yes, iv ... let me makan first and hopefully, the chatbox still have the history after lunch ... I'll see if I can do a copy and paste in another article if ethan has no objections ...
19 Dec 08, 12:45 ivtac: thanks for the warning ethan. hope more ppl read about it. perhaps seng, you can addedum to your posting below?
19 Dec 08, 12:44 Windsurfer: u guys treaten to report police ??
19 Dec 08, 12:44 Windsurfer: ethan, i mean how come the con man gave back the money to u all ..??
19 Dec 08, 12:44 ivtac: a lot of ppl just arent sceptical enough and accept a lot of what anonymous people say, at face value
19 Dec 08, 12:43 ethan: wind, i dont have to proof on the case, as what i say is purely for the benefit of everyone..
19 Dec 08, 12:43 Windsurfer: he scared of u all izzit ??
19 Dec 08, 12:43 Windsurfer: ethan, how come the guy gave back the money ar ??
19 Dec 08, 12:42 ivtac: when it comes to matters relating to markets/money...it pays to be sceptical. if its too good to be true, it usually is
19 Dec 08, 12:42 ethan: we learn from this case that no matter this net person pretend they are good, somehow they will show their face to con u sooner or later
19 Dec 08, 12:42 Seng: What more proof do you need in that situation (assuming the story is true of course).
19 Dec 08, 12:42 Seng: Wind, the poor girl is probably terrified to her wits when the conman didn't want to give back the $8k on her request.
19 Dec 08, 12:42 ivtac: good la at least get back your money. a lesson to be learn lor
19 Dec 08, 12:41 ivtac: but this sort, they will just go prowl another site and try another con
19 Dec 08, 12:41 ethan: and conman leave us forever...
19 Dec 08, 12:41 Windsurfer: now is how u prove he con ur friend ...
19 Dec 08, 12:41 ethan: yes...money is 100% get back
19 Dec 08, 12:41 Seng: But how did you get him to give back the money? Face to face meeting and give him an ultimatum?
19 Dec 08, 12:41 ivtac: so you did get back the money la
19 Dec 08, 12:40 Seng: At best, it's just a trace and a source of lead for further investigation ..
19 Dec 08, 12:40 ethan: so lastly we recover full sum and we ban him and less active in ethansoft ..as i feel sad..haha
19 Dec 08, 12:40 ivtac: of course, but that person would have to be an accomplice
19 Dec 08, 12:40 Seng: Yes ethan, good thinking.
19 Dec 08, 12:40 ethan: actually even i know we can use bank account to trace him, but guy, do u think can he use other people account to get that money
19 Dec 08, 12:40 Windsurfer: so wats ur plan now ??
19 Dec 08, 12:39 Seng: Err ... I think better to keep the name confidential ... I trust ethan has good intentions, but let's not mention it here in this cbox ...
19 Dec 08, 12:39 ethan: dunno where he live, but since we know his id and real name, he cant escape any more...
19 Dec 08, 12:39 ivtac: but as i have seen in many online con cases, its very hard to recover your money even if you make police report
19 Dec 08, 12:38 Windsurfer: where he live ??
19 Dec 08, 12:38 ethan: the way we ask him go out is we want to hand over the money to him
19 Dec 08, 12:38 Windsurfer: u know his name ??
19 Dec 08, 12:38 Seng: a licensed guy some more ... kakakaka
19 Dec 08, 12:38 ethan: that is his mutual fund agent id
19 Dec 08, 12:38 Windsurfer: yalor .. bank acc ..
19 Dec 08, 12:37 ethan: so me and another guy really met him another time, and tis time we get something really unique to indentify him
19 Dec 08, 12:37 Windsurfer: u know him name ??
19 Dec 08, 12:37 ivtac: ethan, bank account details
19 Dec 08, 12:37 Windsurfer: u met the guy no ??
19 Dec 08, 12:37 ethan: but even report police, we only got ip, then do u know how hard we can trace that guy
19 Dec 08, 12:37 Windsurfer: then how u plan to get back the money ??
19 Dec 08, 12:37 ivtac: ethan, its good idea on your part but just a reminder to you. this chatbox also many silent readers, your conman could be one as well
19 Dec 08, 12:36 ethan: since i have recorded all their pm and whatever ip in my server, report police is the last option
19 Dec 08, 12:36 Windsurfer: police report la ..
19 Dec 08, 12:35 ethan: the victim sms, call and do watever to get back the money but the conman just refuse to do so.
19 Dec 08, 12:35 Windsurfer: pls tell me u whack him ..
19 Dec 08, 12:35 ethan: since conman is stil active there, we talk with him as usual but just delay to transfer money , as we want to create honey pot and know more on him
19 Dec 08, 12:34 Windsurfer: whack him la ..
19 Dec 08, 12:34 ivtac: then did you all take any action to track the fella down? police report etc?
19 Dec 08, 12:34 ethan: and that time she know she is being con and ask conman to give back
19 Dec 08, 12:34 ethan: but later on she checkout with us that we have NOT transfer any single cents
19 Dec 08, 12:34 Windsurfer: siao !!
19 Dec 08, 12:33 ethan: then the joker ask her to transfer the money
19 Dec 08, 12:33 ethan: unfortunately , one of the member which didn't join the meet up thought we have transfer money to conman
19 Dec 08, 12:32 Windsurfer: then u all whack him ??
19 Dec 08, 12:32 ethan: and we actually on hold on the fund transfering and at the same time observe him more..
19 Dec 08, 12:32 ethan: after the discussion, that conman look suspicious to us
19 Dec 08, 12:31 ethan: we discuss and talk there..
19 Dec 08, 12:31 ethan: then some of the member show up and of course me too
19 Dec 08, 12:31 ethan: after that, we really have a real meetup at some place in kl area
19 Dec 08, 12:30 ethan: each people initially he want 8k
19 Dec 08, 12:30 ethan: then he invite to create a private fund and he will in charge of executing
19 Dec 08, 12:30 wen: ya, pro con man
19 Dec 08, 12:30 ethan: then he blah blah blah..and some of us interest as he talk like really pro
19 Dec 08, 12:29 mydreamgetrich: yaya... dun let other ppl effect ur investing decision.. if canot tahan just walk off
19 Dec 08, 12:29 Seng: Alamak ethan ... managing money for others is something I strongly advise against ...
19 Dec 08, 12:29 ethan: and he got special right to short from the broker..
19 Dec 08, 12:29 Windsurfer: ethan, y they bugger transfer money to the other bugger ??
19 Dec 08, 12:29 ethan: the case is like this..that guy initially claim he is good in TA trading
19 Dec 08, 12:28 ivtac: ethan you need to tell about the conman's modus operandi too...so that others are warned
19 Dec 08, 12:28 ethan: please be extra careful with net personalities...a lot of liar and cheater there ...so do ur investment and homework wisely
19 Dec 08, 12:28 ethan: the reason i need to recover the money as the member is the victim from my website and i am the site owner, so i really need to warn u all,,
19 Dec 08, 12:27 ivtac: what story did he use?
19 Dec 08, 12:27 ivtac: ethan what was his scheme?
19 Dec 08, 12:27 mydreamgetrich: y u give him ur money?
19 Dec 08, 12:27 ethan: and lucky another 8 -9 members didn't transfer the money to that guy
19 Dec 08, 12:27 ethan: mydreamgetrich, yes..it is a few k
19 Dec 08, 12:26 mydreamgetrich: recover ur money???
19 Dec 08, 12:26 ethan: and initially the conman gain our trust.. but lastly me and another member manage to recover the money by meeting with that conman
19 Dec 08, 12:25 ethan: that conman at my site actually con one of the member and the member transfer some money to him because member trust me
19 Dec 08, 12:24 ethan: as u know, i do setup a chatbox too last time at ethansoft.com, and i also found one conman using more or less the same tactic to manipulate and con other
19 Dec 08, 12:24 Seng: What happened this time?
19 Dec 08, 12:24 Seng: Oh?
19 Dec 08, 12:23 ethan: actually seng today i am here to actually warn and giving another real example on con man in the net
19 Dec 08, 12:23 ethan: just discover newbie naughty personality
19 Dec 08, 12:23 Seng: Hi ethan! Long time no see ... what brings you back here after such a long, long, long absence?
19 Dec 08, 12:22 ethan: long time didn't come here and chat already
19 Dec 08, 12:22 ethan: hi..seng and everyone..
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As usual, don't blindly belief everything you read over the Net, including this article.
Always use your own discretion.
Many thanks to ethan for sharing!
Seng, that's why I HATE seeing people extolling their tips and such on your cbox.
ReplyDeleteSee, using Graham's cigar butt theory... for your cbox with 200 registered members... if say some con-man starts a scheme... and he gets, say 10% to join his scheme... and takes in RM10,000 each... that's RM200,000 conned already.
Of course, the majority of your readers are silent readers, but you get the gist of my example... you don't need to fool EVERYONE... you only need to fool at least 1 person.
BTW, taking newbie as an example... his "success rate" at one point was probably around 80%... if he had started a "newbie fund" without your knowledge, a LOT of your regular readers would have given money to him.
Moolah, Dali, Ivtac, doraiddd, yourself... all hold a lot of power. I'm glad none of you guys have been abusing it.. seriously. It's especially cool that the man who works in a gray area is so upfront and acts with complete integrity when dealing with his "friends" in cbox... chinese saying of "don't shit where you eat"?
Anyhow, Madoff taught us that it is in fact the ones who you trust the most... who are best positioned to do the most damage!
Honestly, at one point, I was talking too much about the size and profits on my own trades, and I got some emails inquiring if I was interested in handling their money.
Guess what i did?
... being a smartass/ coward, I told them that to contact dali/moo/seng/iv/dor instead... wahahahaha!
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